66 posts / 0 new / Last post
#1  May 24, 2018 - 2:58pm
tr04's picture
Offline
Joined: May 2018
Posts: 14
Kudos: 4

I have an Apple TV 4K wired up with a gigabit connection to my server.

Some of my 4K videos will always stutter even without subtitles and with basic stereo or DD5.1 audio tracks. Also doesn’t matter if it’s HDR or not.

The only similarity I can find between them is their bitrates can go over 100Mbps.

Is this possibly a limitation of the hardware or the software? Another issue entirely?

  May 24, 2018 - 9:48pm
NC Bullseye's picture
Moderator
Offline
Joined: May 2016
Posts: 2,666
Kudos: 380

I'd try a new Ethernet cable and probably at least a cat 6.

For the first time in my live not long ago I had an Ethernet cable that failed and not a hard failure, it cut my speeds almost in half. New cable, problem solved.

•Just Another Infuse User• •Not An Employee Of Firecore• •Certified Curmudgeon•

  May 24, 2018 - 10:18pm
tr04's picture
Offline
Joined: May 2018
Posts: 14
Kudos: 4
  NC Bullseye wrote:

I'd try a new Ethernet cable and probably at least a cat 6.

For the first time in my live not long ago I had an Ethernet cable that failed and not a hard failure, it cut my speeds almost in half. New cable, problem solved.

It's definitely not an issue with that line's connection speed.

https://i.imgur.com/jcMeSjh.png
https://i.imgur.com/iE6ANBU.png

Here's a video showing the "stutter"

https://youtu.be/BV-VFSQUOLg

Maybe it's not even an issue with the bitrate? Maybe some sort of rendering bug?

  May 24, 2018 - 10:50pm
astirling's picture
Beta Tester
Offline
Joined: Mar 2017
Posts: 153
Kudos: 37

4k Star Wars? Does it happen on any 4k material which has been officially released? Just wondering if it’s a problem with the source file.

  May 24, 2018 - 11:40pm
tr04's picture
Offline
Joined: May 2018
Posts: 14
Kudos: 4
  astirling wrote:

4k Star Wars? Does it happen on any 4k material which has been officially released? Just wondering if it’s a problem with the source file.

Off the top of my head, I have had similar glitches with Bridge on the River Kwai and Zero Dark Thirty but only in a few scenes and not nearly as extreme as this example. Here's the MediaInfo for this Star Wars movie for what its worth:

  

General
Complete name : /Volumes/Media Server/4K HDR Movies/Star Wars 4 A New Hope 4K77.mkv
Format : Matroska
Format version : Version 4 / Version 2
File size : 82.0 GiB
Duration : 2h 2mn
Overall bit rate : 96.1 Mbps
Movie name : Star Wars 4K77 (2018)
Encoded date : UTC 2018-05-23 05:35:32
Writing application : mkvmerge v23.0.0 ('The Bride Said No') 64-bit
Writing library : libebml v1.3.6 + libmatroska v1.4.9

Video
ID : 1
Format : HEVC
Format/Info : High Efficiency Video Coding
Format profile : Main 10@L5.1@High
Codec ID : V_MPEGH/ISO/HEVC
Duration : 2h 2mn
Bit rate : 89.4 Mbps
Width : 3 840 pixels
Height : 2 160 pixels
Display aspect ratio : 16:9
Frame rate mode : Constant
Frame rate : 23.976 (24000/1001) fps
Color space : YUV
Chroma subsampling : 4:2:0
Bit depth : 10 bits
Bits/(Pixel*Frame) : 0.450
Stream size : 76.3 GiB (93%)
Title : Star Wars 4K77 (2018)
Language : English
Default : No
Forced : No

Audio #1
ID : 2
Format : DTS
Format/Info : Digital Theater Systems
Format profile : MA / Core
Codec ID : A_DTS
Duration : 2h 1mn
Bit rate mode : Variable / Constant
Bit rate : 1 642 Kbps / 1 509 Kbps
Channel(s) : 2 channels
Channel positions : / Front: L R
Sampling rate : 48.0 KHz
Frame rate : 93.750 fps (512 SPF)
Bit depth : 16 bits
Compression mode : Lossless / Lossy
Stream size : 1.39 GiB (2%)
Title : English Stereo (1977 35mm mix)
Language : English
Default : No
Forced : No

Anything look odd? The file plays perfectly fine on my computer, even over WiFi.

Tomorrow I'm going to put the movie into an M4V and MOV container. Maybe it will play nicer with Apple's software.

  May 25, 2018 - 8:34am
james's picture
Staff
Offline
Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 13,951
Kudos: 1,186

We have had a similar report with this exact video, and are looking into what we can do to resolve this.

FWIW, in the past we've addressed similar issues for videos with incorrectly ordered frames, and it's likely there is something similar going on here as well.

Stay tuned.

Infuse 6 for iOS and Apple TV is now available!

  May 25, 2018 - 5:06pm
FranklyOnline's picture
Offline
Joined: Feb 2017
Posts: 4
Kudos: 0

My 2cents.. under AppleTVs own config -> video and audio -> match content (Matcha innehåll).. change from Off to ON.. it may flicker between 50/24 every time you start an app or video depending on TV etc but after I changed it to ON I could watch Black Panther 4K (hevc) (streaming from my QNAP NAS) onto 1920x1080 (FHD..not 4K) Samsung TV and Apple TV 4 (not Apple TV 4K) without stuttering. If Match Content is off, it started to stutter on that 4K movie.. (and as I doesn’t have a 4K screen there is no obvious reason to download 4K for me.. this was just one of the simpler tests I did with diff 4K sample videos with Infuse and my Apple TV 4).

But I know there are many other 4K videos that aint able to pull it thru due higher bitrate etc.. for that Apple TV 4 K would be needed as A10 can chump hevc directly..

  May 25, 2018 - 5:16pm
FranklyOnline's picture
Offline
Joined: Feb 2017
Posts: 4
Kudos: 0

My other 2cent.. If it is a ”pirated copy” of a movie that seems to have a problem I would suggest the possibility of a copyprotection scheme used.. the movie “John Wick” have a “funny” copy protection scheme that results in a copy were the chapters are changed! Why not the possibility of a copy protection scheme that jerks with the frame rate or otherwise?

  May 25, 2018 - 5:57pm
tr04's picture
Offline
Joined: May 2018
Posts: 14
Kudos: 4
  FranklyOnline wrote:

My 2cents.. under AppleTVs own config -> video and audio -> match content (Matcha innehåll).. change from Off to ON..

I always keep that setting on.

  FranklyOnline wrote:

My other 2cent.. If it is a ”pirated copy” of a movie that seems to have a problem I would suggest the possibility of a copyprotection scheme used..

The Star Wars movie is a fan-made film scan that is distributed exclusively through torrenting for now. In the case of the other movies, the glitching is far less noticeable in Infuse and doesn't appear at all during playback on other devices.

  james wrote:

We have had a similar report with this exact video, and are looking into what we can do to resolve this.

FWIW, in the past we've addressed similar issues for videos with incorrectly ordered frames, and it's likely there is something similar going on here as well.

Stay tuned.

Thanks! This was the first video where I've seen this "glitch" this severe. Hopefully it's nothing too difficult to find the cause.

  May 27, 2018 - 4:17am
lambdan's picture
Offline
Joined: May 2018
Posts: 3
Kudos: 0

I also get the same janky movement with this exact video. Also happens in the Plex app and MrMC.
Does not happen in VLC for tvOS, but it does stutter/drop frames there.

  May 29, 2018 - 5:19am
RiotNrrrd's picture
Offline
Joined: May 2018
Posts: 8
Kudos: 1
  tr04 wrote:

Here's a video showing the "stutter"

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BV-VFSQUOLg

Maybe it's not even an issue with the bitrate? Maybe some sort of rendering bug?

Wow, that's janky. Does it only happen at that particular point in the movie? Or does it happen randomly in many different places?

Just as a control, I've put it on a SanDisk USB 3.0 stick and plugged it directly into my 2016 LG OLED6EP and it plays perfectly - so far. (I stopped it at the Canteen scene, so I didn't get as far as your stutter glitch point - but I had zero problems up until the point where I stopped playback.)

P.S. I'm keenly interested in this issue as I have an  TV 4K coming in a few days and the first thing I'm going to do is buy Infuse 5 Pro for it. Would rather play 4K77 off of my Mac mini's RAID via Infuse on the  TV 4K than have to stick a USB stick in the TV all the time.

  June 3, 2018 - 8:09pm
mdfverona's picture
Offline
Joined: Jun 2018
Posts: 2
Kudos: 0

Any update on 4K77 UHD playback?

The only way I've been able to watch it so far is with a long cord to my i7 win 10 desktop, but then DTS doesn't work so I end up on the non-DTS '83 remix audio, and to be fair the whole reason I got the ATV4K and Infuse was to stop doing nonsense like that!

  June 4, 2018 - 8:55pm
RiotNrrrd's picture
Offline
Joined: May 2018
Posts: 8
Kudos: 1

I got an Apple TV 4K over the weekend, and immediately purchased Infuse 5 Pro and installed it.

My initial reaction is mainly favorable (it played most of my test files I threw at it) but when it came to 4K77, it failed miserably.

I got the janky stuttering pretty much from the get-go - opening scroll.

Of course, the problem now is that there's no way to know if it's an Infuse problem, an Apple TV 4K the-hardware-isn't-good-enough problem or a playing-an-80-Mbps-file-over-Gigabit-Ethernet-off-of-a-Mac-mini-Thunderbolt-attached-RAID-box problem. Or (d) all of the above. Confused

  June 7, 2018 - 10:16am
mdfverona's picture
Offline
Joined: Jun 2018
Posts: 2
Kudos: 0

I've had the file playback well now in a few places - MPV on Linux, Windows 10's built-in Movies, and now off a USB to an LG 4k OLED. Its funny the LG specs say it only does 50Mbps HEVC max but it had no problems at all playing it.

I tried re-muxing it with latest MKV tools and reduced the audio tracks to just the 3 main english DTS ones (stereo, 5.1, mono) but that didn't help with Infuse on ATV4K playback. I tried hardwiring to my main 1Gbps switch too but also no joy.

MPV doesn't show any real errors - just one or two during the crawl but otherwise it seems pretty happy with the file.

  June 21, 2018 - 11:45am
mizterjawsh's picture
Offline
Joined: Jun 2018
Posts: 1
Kudos: 0

James,

Any update on this by chance? Appreciate your help.

  June 22, 2018 - 7:12am
molnizzle's picture
Offline
Joined: Mar 2018
Posts: 29
Kudos: 10

This video is apparently just encoded poorly. I get choppy playback on my PC as well.

  June 22, 2018 - 10:21am
tr04's picture
Offline
Joined: May 2018
Posts: 14
Kudos: 4
  molnizzle wrote:

This video is apparently just encoded poorly. I get choppy playback on my PC as well.

Windows/Mac? VLC/some other player?

It's weird. It plays perfectly fine on my computer even from my NAS over WiFi. But if I copy the video to my iPhone and try to play it in the Apple Photos app or the VLC app, I get the same stuttery playback I get on my Apple TV.

  June 25, 2018 - 11:21pm
dunnie's picture
Offline
Joined: Sep 2016
Posts: 7
Kudos: 3

I have a similar problem. set the picture frequency to 50hz or 60hz at settings video and see if that helps.

  June 26, 2018 - 3:23pm
slashtom's picture
Offline
Joined: Jun 2018
Posts: 10
Kudos: 1

So I’ve had the exact same issue with the appletv 4K and infuse and this video.

It’s a bitrate issue and how you mount your drive.

The only way this worked was with my Vero 4K over WiFi AC and nfs mount with fstab.

Does infuse or tvOS support fstab? Simply doing nfs mount on Vero 4K produces dropped frames with fstab it produced flawless playback.

  July 12, 2018 - 7:41pm
shpankey's picture
Offline
Joined: Jul 2018
Posts: 10
Kudos: 0

Exact same problem here, identical to your example video. It happens only on hevc encodes for me (I use staxrip via Intel h/w encoder). These hevc files play perfectly fine on roku, xbox one, ps4 pro, pc (vlc) w/ no issue, but stutters on my apple tv 4k and ios in Infuse or native plex app. Identical to your example! I have over a hundred of these files it does it on (hevc encodes).

Can Infuse please at least add an option to force transcoding at the individual file level like the native client please? Until then it's totally worthless to me. Either that or fix this issue that no other system has.

I'm so close to giving up on Apple and going to a roku for all my clients.

  July 13, 2018 - 1:58pm
james's picture
Staff
Offline
Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 13,951
Kudos: 1,186
  shpankey wrote:

Exact same problem here, identical to your example video. It happens only on hevc encodes for me (I use staxrip via Intel h/w encoder). These hevc files play perfectly fine on roku, xbox one, ps4 pro, pc (vlc) w/ no issue, but stutters on my apple tv 4k and ios in Infuse or native plex app. Identical to your example! I have over a hundred of these files it does it on (hevc encodes).

Can Infuse please at least add an option to force transcoding at the individual file level like the native client please? Until then it's totally worthless to me. Either that or fix this issue that no other system has.

I'm so close to giving up on Apple and going to a roku for all my clients.

The original issue described in this thread is actually related to a specific video (Star Wars 4 A New Hope 4K77.mkv), so if you are seeing this with a different file there may be something else going on.

If you have a chance to send in a sample we can review here it could be helpful.

Samples (up to 20GB in size) can be uploaded here.
https://firecore.com/upload

Infuse 6 for iOS and Apple TV is now available!

  July 16, 2018 - 4:46pm
cmcclure16's picture
Beta Tester
Offline
Joined: Sep 2017
Posts: 1
Kudos: 0

Strangely, when I finished downloading this file last night I loaded it up to just test it out real quick and it seemed to play just fine in both Infuse and the official Plex app (though it had to transcode the DTS-HD audio).

Now this afternoon when I tried to load it up to actually watch it, it is now stuttering in both apps. I did just update Plex Media Server so I wonder if that has anything to do with it?

  July 17, 2018 - 1:31pm
james's picture
Staff
Offline
Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 13,951
Kudos: 1,186
  cmcclure16 wrote:

Strangely, when I finished downloading this file last night I loaded it up to just test it out real quick and it seemed to play just fine in both Infuse and the official Plex app (though it had to transcode the DTS-HD audio).

Now this afternoon when I tried to load it up to actually watch it, it is now stuttering in both apps. I did just update Plex Media Server so I wonder if that has anything to do with it?

There was another post awhile back from someone who experienced something similar, and they were able to trace it back to a high amount of disk IO activity on the computer they were streaming from. During periods of low activity everything would play fine.

Perhaps something similar is going on in your case?

Infuse 6 for iOS and Apple TV is now available!

  July 17, 2018 - 1:39pm
shpankey's picture
Offline
Joined: Jul 2018
Posts: 10
Kudos: 0
  james wrote:

The original issue described in this thread is actually related to a specific video (Star Wars 4 A New Hope 4K77.mkv), so if you are seeing this with a different file there may be something else going on.

If you have a chance to send in a sample we can review here it could be helpful.

Samples (up to 20GB in size) can be uploaded here.
https://firecore.com/upload

Ok, will do soon when I get some time. In the meantime, can you talk about the ability to force transcoding, like the native plex client? Doing this solves the problem for me, though I realize it's not ideal, it is the solution I'm currently using, which means as of now, I can't use Infuse because it doesn't have that ability (that I'm aware of, correct me if I'm wrong though).

  July 20, 2018 - 9:43am
shpankey's picture
Offline
Joined: Jul 2018
Posts: 10
Kudos: 0
  james wrote:

The original issue described in this thread is actually related to a specific video (Star Wars 4 A New Hope 4K77.mkv), so if you are seeing this with a different file there may be something else going on.

If you have a chance to send in a sample we can review here it could be helpful.

Samples (up to 20GB in size) can be uploaded here.
https://firecore.com/upload

File uploaded... note this file plays fine on everything but the Apple TV 4k and iOS. LMK and thanks

  July 21, 2018 - 3:42am
dunnie's picture
Offline
Joined: Sep 2016
Posts: 7
Kudos: 3

movies in 1080P must you the videosettings on 50hz. and UHD movies 60hz. I hope that Apple this problem wil fix it soon.

  July 27, 2018 - 9:55am
shpankey's picture
Offline
Joined: Jul 2018
Posts: 10
Kudos: 0

Did that file help show anything James? tia

  July 30, 2018 - 3:30pm
james's picture
Staff
Offline
Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 13,951
Kudos: 1,186
  shpankey wrote:

Did that file help show anything James? tia

Thanks for the upload.

Yours seems to be a related issue...looking into this.

Infuse 6 for iOS and Apple TV is now available!

  September 7, 2018 - 4:15am
imtorn's picture
Offline
Joined: Sep 2018
Posts: 2
Kudos: 0

Any update on this, James? I have the same issue...

  September 7, 2018 - 12:05pm
james's picture
Staff
Offline
Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 13,951
Kudos: 1,186

This is still on our radar, and something we will probably be able to look into once we wrap up the 5.8.2 update which (among other things) is geared towards getting a few things tuned up for iOS/tvOS 12.

FWIW, this issue is only present with a few select files that have been improperly encoded.

Infuse 6 for iOS and Apple TV is now available!

  September 7, 2018 - 4:01pm
imtorn's picture
Offline
Joined: Sep 2018
Posts: 2
Kudos: 0

Thanks James - I appreciate the update and fast response! I can't speak to whether the encoding is proper or not but the same file plays flawlessly on my LG TV from a USB drive. That's not a good solution for me, though, so I'm holding out for improved compatibility with Infuse, which seems like a great product - hopefully it will come fairly soon... Keep up the great work!